Day 8 -

Still Learning to Back Up

Today was another day of mixed emotions. First, lets talk about the really good things.

Lilly is done with her travel quarantine!!! This means she can now be with other horses at the boarding facility.

There are two options.

The first option is to put her in a smaller pen surrounded by other horses so she can get to know the horses over the fence and eventually be put in a larger pen with an older gelding.

Positives - She has a buddy, doesn't have to fight for food as much, will have a bigger shelter, easier for me to be in the space with just two horses, she will have a getting to know time before being put in the pen with the 1 horse.

Negatives - smaller area, only one friend which can make it more challenging, gets super attached, does not learn good herd behavior, she is going to be in a very small pen during the get to know you time which might last a few weeks.

Second Option:

Be in a much larger space with 6 other older horses. There is lots of space to run around. There is a lead gelding and 5 other mares. The lead gelding and one mare are put inside every night. Than a different mare in the herd is the boss. There is a smaller shelter that two horses can fit in at a time.

Positives - she has a LOT of space to run around, she has the ability to learn from all the herd, she learns how to be a good horse

Negatives - she won't have a getting to know them time across a fence. She will be low man on the totem pole, she will have to be wait for her turn to eat at the beginning but then once the herd is established she will have her own spot to eat or even eat next to another horse.

No matter what the scenario I will be taking her out of her pen to feed her supplements 2 times a day. I will be spending time with her 2 times a day.

I posted the two choices in my horse facebook groups to get everyone's opinions. The majority of people voted for option 2. These were the reasons why.

I would choose the bigger space. The herd dynamics will work itself out. They need room to move. Hard on their mental and physical health to live in small spaces. As for the shelter. The herd I know have access to a very large shelter most of the time they stand in the weather.

Imho option 2 is the more interesting (even though option 1 would be more than ok, if ever). From my personal experience, I had the chance to "chaperone" several weanlings over the last years, and knew their life from 2 month old till 7 or 8 years, so from birth to adult horse. And all the horses that lived in larger herds and most of space possible, all through the seasons, were the healthiest I ever met, in- and outside. Never sick with a bomb-proof immune system, no behaviour probs because educated by the elder horses, the most cooperative when it came to starting them under saddle. No comparison with the other youngsters that grew up with restricted space or just one pal around. Only thing that would be a point to consider: if living with mares around, prepare to geld him during next year, as soon as you see that the hormones start to tickle him. (my note - I do not know why this person thought it was a male horse - there were no gender pronouns in the post). Enjoy the time with your young horse, no matter what you decide - it is such a beautiful road to go!

number 2. you can take him out to feed separately if necessary. Yearlings need to be able to run. All horses actually.

...Your weanling is going to be bottom of the totem pole so won't get to use an inadequate shelter, but introductions actually seem to go smoother with weanlings because they show submission so the herd dynamic is less of a problem....I would not choose a single friend situation if the friend is likely to be easily annoyed or can be aggressive. ...

2 ! More friends and large space so no excessive fighting to be expected. Being constantly around one other horse makes them to attached to each other in the long run....

2. Intro will be rougher but I've found introducing a baby is always pretty smooth.
A bigger group with more space will make a much more socially stable, polite and calm horse.

Just my opinion - but nothing beats mares for teaching horses how to be horses.
The danger of putting just two horses together is they get too dependent on each other and then a fuss is made when you separate them - I see this at my barn all the time.

2-- especially for a colt going in with mares. Nothing teaches a young horse manners like mares. I responded and told her, Lilly is a girl. in that case she should integrate with absolutely minimal fuss. The gelding will be kind to a filly and the mares should be tolerant but teach her how to be a good horse

Young horses benefit from being out in a larger group, male or female.

#2 for lots of the same reasons mentioned above!

I am surprised that 2 is mentioned as an option if he is still a colt he certainly is capable of getting all the mares pregnant but that is what I would choose also I responded and told her, Lilly is a girl. lol. Definitely 2 then

Horses are naturally herd animals . I have a herd with weanlings and all left together , it teaches them manners, spacial awareness , they learn a lot ( all my mares and geldings take shifts in watching the babies sleep , none of them are heard bound and I regularly take 1 out to work with and graze differently , no dramas .

No2. young horses should have big spaces and be part of a herd growing up. They need movement to grow strong, they need other horses to teach them to be a horse. Here in New Zealand it's a bonus if you can grow your young horses out on big hills. That way they grow slow and strong, they learn to stay on their feet and use their bodies

2 babies should be out and learning from a herd.

Big herd every time for a youngster

2 for babies. Option one would be good for a retired horse.

Big herd will help her to feel safe in a social setting. To learn how to interact with multiple personalities.
It will also challenge more, to increase movement and mental stimulation. Both good for all horses but especially young ones.
The more they run the better the body grows, stronger more flexible muscles, increased lung and heart development, and better hoof structure.

The best thing I did for my Fell Pony weanling gelding was board him in a 12 acre pasture with 6 other geldings. Youngest 6yo oldest 21 yo
Yes. He made some mistakes but was shepherded by a 12yo TB who ran interference when Olympus would earn the ire of the group patriarch. The “uncles” took such good care of him !
He learned horse language and horse manners. He also was the leader of the morning gallop around the perimeter of the pasture. After the morning hay he’d go from horse to horse nipping and running to the next uncle. When he had every gelding’s attention he’d invite them to chase him and off they’d go.
It was a wonderful experience for both of us.

So based on all the feedback I got from all the horse people on facebook I have decided to do option 2. So I told Jerry (the guy that takes care of the horses) that we would do option 2 putting her with the herd. Andi (the lady who runs OAS) mentioned to have a lead rope - implying that there will be drama. Hopefully there is little drama. I am nervous - but I think in the long run this will be the best thing for her. I want her to grow up with a "herd."

The things going for her is that she knows how to behave in a herd. She has been in a herd before. She usually gets one friend but does do the herd dynamics. She was raised her whole life (so far) in a herd in Pennsylvania so I think this is where she will be the happiest. I want her to happy and healthy.

Today the skill we continued working on is haltering and backing up. Since she is so pushy it is important that we get this skill really solid. The problem is - horses learn very fast. So she has already learned that she can do things the "wrong" way. So I have to work on being very clear with my communication. I have to be patient while she is learning how to respond in the correct way.

When watching the videos on how to teach a horse how to back up - I thought it would be easier. But it is definitely NOT easy.

Haltering and Backing Up

Wait Time and More Backing Up

Some positive today were I gave her more wait time. After she completed the skill I gave her time to process what just happened and waited for her to show signs of relaxation (licking and chewing). When she showed those signs we tried again. She still does not understand what she is suppose to do. So I am going to watch the videos more and see what I did wrong.

Other news - I am trying to buy a vehicle. The one I was going to buy fell through so I am trying to buy another one. He is bringing the 1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee today. Hopefully it works out. A big snow storm is coming to our area this weekend and it is not going to work to ride my bike out there.